I feel kind of dumb - intermittent adhesion issues and cleaning plate

Bambu Lab A Series General Discussions
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So, I’ve been wanting to pull my hair out with intermittent adhesion issues, I pretty much exclusively use a WhamBam PEX plate, I have one for both my A1 and my A1 mini, had GREAT adhesion from the get go, on the A1 mini I didn’t scuff the PEX plate though because I wanted a glossy base for my prints (printing earrings mostly on the mini). Anyway, recently I’ve been having intermittent issues on both machines, and it was driving me bonkers. I was thinking it was my nozzles (they’re getting kind of gunky, and also I’ve been using matte PLA in the regular stainless steel), or the new PLA I bought (though it was happening with not new PLA), environmental (I live in the Deep South and it’s been especially humid). I have my printers in my laundry room, and while it’s just me and not a ton of laundry, I’m assuming that adds moisture to the air, it’s generally about 50% humidity in there if not more. I’m going to get a dehumidifier for that room anyway, but I digress.

Shortly after I got the WhamBam plates, I ordered some 99% IPA, and have gotten in the habit of exclusively cleaning with that. So convenient. On the A1 sometimes I’d use the scuffing pad, but realize I had gotten pretty lazy just wiping them down with the alcohol and a paper towel. Looks so clean and oil free when I was doing that.

So, finally this morning I spent some dedicated time reading troubleshooting advice and I read that just using IPA can just push around any oils that are on the bed, and to use soap and water. Soap and water which I read SO MANY times while browsing about printing adhesion issues and it didn’t even DAWN (see what I did there) ON ME to try that. Sure enough, some simple dish soap and water and it’s back to adhering just fine. HOURS wasted. I hate when I get locked in to *some other possibilities for an issue*, and forget about the basics. So, even though the IPA made it look nice and shiny and clean, apparently there was residual something being left behind over time.

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Be careful how you think, I am one of the ones that recommend dish soap and hot water, BUT I can clean with IPA, once you understand what can go wrong with IPA it is still useable., Basicly you cant clean anything with a dirty rag, which is one reason the dish soap and hot rinse work so good, but you can wipe with IPA, then get a fresh towel and wipe again and so on untill clean, but this is more time consuming than a simple wash and rinse at the sink.

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A common misconception is that dish soap and isopropyl alcohol are interchangeable, when in fact they complement each other.

  • Dish soap removes around ~90% of substances that could contaminate a printing plate.
  • Isopropyl takes care of the remaining ~10%. It is ideal for heavily stained print plates or complex prints. If you want to push your printer to its limits.
  • Using only isopropyl or only dish soap will not remove all contaminants. There is no such thing as a “one size fits all” solution.

That’s why the standard procedure for cleaning modern printing plates is to use dish soap first. If that doesn’t remove all the dirt or if you’re dealing with extremely demanding prints, spray very carefully with isopropyl alcohol. Then gently wipe it off and let it dry. Under no circumstances should you rub it vigorously or soak the plate.

This is why isopropyl is only suitable for the final touch, rather than rigorous scrubbing.

Statements such as ‘Use only soap’ or ‘Use only isopropyl’ are therefore wrong. Both have their intended uses, but knowing how and when to use them is where people often fall short.

Unfortunately, your comment follows the same pattern. You haven’t understood that it is supplementary, not replacement. A typical beginner’s mistake - no offense meant; it’s happened to all of us at some point. Above all, I totally understand that it can be confusing to hear so many different opinions on this.

Learn from it - you’ll always be a little wiser afterward. Next time, you’ll know when to use soap and when to use isopropyl alcohol, but that doesn’t make either one any less important.

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Hear hear! Been preaching this for years but your take is quicker and more to the point than my usual ramblings! A big part of the dish soap method’s success is the suspension of contaminates and the rinse vs just smearing the goo around with IPA and a single paper towel.

That said, I’ll confess that I have not cleaned my original textured plate in a year or two.

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These kinds of topics usually get even worse when someone who owns an ancient printer crawls out of their hole and says, “Just smear some glue on it!” or “Use sandpaper!” - which, unfortunately, we still see quite often.

That used to be the case with old printers, but these days we have state-of-the-art print plates.

Though, it must be said that Bambu is actively working to address this outdated information and provides very detailed instructions on how to clean print plates:

..and Wiki:

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Keep both in your toolkit IMO. They work to dissolve different molecules and you dont really get to know too clearly which will work best if at all :slight_smile: One important part of IPA is that you literally do nothing if you just spray:: you must spray to flood; and wipe with absorbant towel/etc to remove the liquid+dissolved crapola.

//you now have a rag soaked in IPA that is a breath hazard and fire hazard, so dont be too silly

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I’m a bit frustrated that you’re first going to “alcohol has a purpose and people who say otherwise are wrong” and then to “Bambu is setting the record straight” …and the linked page discourages the use of isopropyl.

The venn diagram of “stuff that gets on the build plate from printing” and “stuff that hot water and dishsoap WON’T remove” is a pretty skinny sliver, and if you consider the typical post about build plate adhesion, IPA is almost never the answer.

Is there room for nuance in this debate? Yes, absolutely. See what I did there? Seriously, though, for the sake of helping newbies, I think keeping it simple is best. People seem to flock towards isopropyl for reasons I don’t understand, and when they go to it first, we get even more posts about adhesion issues…which we really don’t need.

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Two different perspectives that you overlooked:

  • First, my initial commentary section, which is aimed at experienced users and real-world applications - for users who want to push their printers to the limit.
  • Bambus’s tutorials and videos, which are aimed at absolute beginners who have just unboxed their printer.

Of course, Bambu focuses on beginners and wants to prevent them from soaking their print plate in isopropyl alcohol and damaging it. However, users with some experience appreciate the purpose and uses of isopropanol.

That’s not a contradiction.

“Bambu is setting the record straight” It’s clearly a misinterpretation on your part to think that’s what I meant. I have no idea how you came up with that, just ask nicely next time - that way, you won’t end up feeling frustrated.

Always make this distinction: My perspective is aimed at experienced users. Bambu’s perspective is aimed at people who have just unboxed the printer. :+1:

And if you take another close look at the context, I refered to sandpaper and glue - that was the actual context.

…and by the way, where in the wiki does it say that you shouldn’t never ever use isopropyl?

It explicitly mentions only acetone. If I missed that, please post it - thanks. :+1:

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Edit: I’d like to address this again, because I think it’s a misinterpretation:

  • Soap is a tool.
  • Isopropyl is a tool.

Both have their uses. Like any tool, you just have to know how to use them.

I think it’s inappropriate to make sweeping generalisations. Instead, people need to learn what is needed for what purpose. This could be soap, isopropyl alcohol, or even different print plates. This is the path from beginner to experienced user. And we’ve all made a lot of mistakes up to that point.

A tool isn’t useless just because people often use it incorrectly.

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By the way, if anyone like to read other opinions - this is actually a never-ending topic of discussion in the community:

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A note about “Use sandpaper!”: it can be an effective last resort for the textured PEI plate. The wiki mentions it, almost in passing:

Grinding the surface of the Textured PEI plate with fine sandpaper or steel wool will create a new, clean surface and enhance the build plate’s adhesion. It’s essential to ensure the surface must be properly cleaned of any sanding debris.

But I really do mean as a last resort – not I repeat not as routine maintenance. I recently was having severe adhesion problems; after some 800 or 900 hours of printing on the plate, it had just stopped holding prints effectively.

It was driving me crazy. No amount of cleaning was working. I finally got desperate and pulled out some #0 steel wool and a spray bottle of soapy water, and wet sanded the plate. You don’t want to press hard or sand heavily. A little pressure is all you need to scuff the surface. If you can see visual results of your work, you did too much. You’re just roughening it up at the microscopic level. Err on the side of less – you can always do a second round if needed. (I did. My first pass was too light a touch.)

Anyway. That’s my experience.

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