The definitive “AMS-compatible support material for PETG” thread

Bambu Lab X1 Series Troubleshooting
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Preamble

I’m not sending back my X1 Carbon AMS Combo due to stupid PLA clog issues with supports for PETG. Supporting PETG is notoriously difficult and everyone seems to have issues with it. Switching to ABS with HIPS and dissolving it in D-Limonele is out of scope here, I am aware this is a thing. I use PETG to print functional parts while not destroying my lungs indoors. There has to be a way to reliably print PETG with breakaway or soluble support material compatible with AMS. After extensive research I wasn’t able to find any definitive answers to this question and after having to disassemble and reassemble the X1C extruder 5 times because of clogged PLA on the inside no matter what settings I set for printing that specific part I am hoping we find answers together as community.

My findings so far:

PLA (tested SUNLU MetaPLA, Bambu Basic PLA) as support interface material for PETG (eSUN PETG) is a mess. Even with flush volumes cranked to 800 mm³, prime tower enabled, cooling enabled after 1st layer as suggested in Support Filament --> PETG for PLA and PLA for PETG and more - #24 by Finsterwald and nozzle temps set as close as 10 °C difference (as suggested in linked thread) between the two materials, I had one extruder clog after another (blobs of filament stuck between gears) and neither AMS nor me were able to pull back filament from extruder requiring full disassembly, cutting filament at different places and so on. On top of that, if printed successfully, layer adhesion of the part is much weaker than PETG with PETG supports. PETG alone (SUNLU, eSun) prints quite well on the PEI plate, no complaints here.

Better support alternatives to plain PLA then (no clogs, AMS compatible)… No official Bambu support material for PETG (Support W and Support G both “cannot be used with PETG”), no official Bambu PETG either. Has anyone tested any of the following for PETG support with the AMS and could please share their experiences?

Formfutura Atlas Support

Cardboard spool, not recommended by Bambu for AMS use.

Formfutura Helios Support

Cardboard spool, not recommended by Bambu for AMS use. This one is advertised as “No nozzle clogging up to 255 °C” and should be a better match for printing PETG with X1C / AMS on the higher end of the temperature range that you would typically use for high speed printing.

Any PVA

PVA officially not recommended to use with AMS (referenced in manual), using well-dried PVA from certain brands might work. Anyone tested something that actually doesn’t clog and works with AMS?

BVOH

Supposed to be the successor to PVA and dissolve much quicker. BVOH with plastic spool is available from BASF, Verbatim, Fiberlogy, PrimaSelect.

Polymaker Poly Dissolve S1

A bit pricey, PVA-based, good PETG support according to manufacturer info sheet. Finally, a plastic spool. The only other brand officially supported by Bambu, though not this exact material. Hey BambuLab, any plans to add a profile for this?

AquaSys 120

Expensive specialized water-soluble material that’s supposed to be compatible with pretty much everything including PETG. No documented success with AMS so far: Reddit - Dive into anything

Buying a dual-extruder / IDEX like the Snapmaker J1 for printing PVA / BVOH

Please don’t make me have to do this. I enjoy my X1C a lot EXCEPT for printing PETG.

Looking forward to the discussion and if anyone can test any of the mentioned I’m sure the community would be happy to know :slight_smile:

– Alex

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In case anyone is wondering, our Prusa colleagues with MMU2 have very bad luck too: https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-i3-mmu2s-mmu2-how-do-i-print-this-printing-help/soluble-support-for-petg-full-interface-layer/

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Hi Alexander95,

I use this it’s not cheap stuff but it works with petg and more plus it works in the AMS also :+1:

AQUATEK X1 ADVANCED USM UNIVERSAL SUPPORT MATERIAL

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Excellent! (though 119 € here for 500 g) What are your extrusion temps for this and the PETG materials? My understanding is that to avoid clogs one needs a material made for higher print temperatures, ideally same as your PETG printing temperature.

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I have used it with petg @ 265c with this usm support with no problems with the ams my support interface speed was 30mm/s I have used Atlas with petg but I would buy the usm support way better stuff when you need the high temps and works with other filaments also :grinning:

I have also used Polymaker S1 but I would only use it for pla.

PVA3
PVA3531×583 30 KB

PVA2
PVA2692×640 39.7 KB

PVA1
PVA1694×999 55.5 KB

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I have a spool of PolyDissolve S1 here and I have plans to test it when I get to it.

I have kinda same goals as you - printing functional parts in-doors and do care about my health. I just haven’t gotten into supports yet, because I am still working on optimising PETG on its own.

Have you looked into other filaments where you could have used Support G with?

PAHT-CF looks promising. Toxicity of filaments Perhaps you have something to add? Maybe PAHT-CF not being safe printing indoors?

I plan to start with PA after I assemble bentobox.

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Looking forward to your S1 results. I haven’t found a cheap alternative to PETG. PA is much more expensive, I run through many kilos of PETG for my clients. Switching to PLA+ with Support W may be an option in some cases but not all. PLA just isn’t a good material, ABS is toxic, ASA is as toxic and relatively expensive, PA-CF also expensive.
Back on topic, I’m tempted to try the Formfutura Helios stuff with PETG, just print the cardboard spool adapters for the AMS first.

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Ah costs… I see. I do not have this problem, because I am just printing prototypes for myself.

Regarding S1… I did not find much info online, but it seems that it is very weak material that gets easily ripped. Considering this: https://forum.prusa3d.com/forum/original-prusa-i3-mmu2s-mmu2-hardware-firmware-and-software-help/polymaker-polydissolve-s1/
Using AMS looks like a long shot. What do you think?

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True, but not many people have tried. It’s like some reporting PVA is a no-go, but maybe they forgot to properly dry it before use…
Edit: PCTG looks quite interesting, but again relatively high printing temperatures will need high-temp support material for single-extruder use.

Idea: Try “high-temp PLA” to try reduce nozzle clogging: High-Temp 3D PLA Filament 1,75 mm, 750 g, Natur
This one has unusually high print temp up to 240 °C which is nice because PETG at 240 °C usually works just fine.

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I am still waiting on my P1P, but I’ve been using my heavily-modified MonoPrice Maker Select V2 for years. (The Bambu will be slight upgrade :slightly_smiling_face:). I mostly print with PETG, but I keep a separate hot-end for PLA (and another for TPU) because of issues with clogging. I have theories why this happens:

  1. When going from PETG to PLA, some PETG doesn’t get flushed from the hot-end and when printing at cooler temperatures, it can’t be extruded once it makes it to the nozzle.
  2. When going from PLA to PETG, some PLA doesn’t get flushed and then gets burnt and hardened from the higher temperatures and can’t be extruded once it makes it to the nozzle.

I’ve heard a lot about using PLA as support for PETG. I think this is probably easier with a dual hot-ends because it avoids clogging issues from filament-swaps.
I’ve bought some of the high-temperature PLA you mentioned and will give it a try once my P1P arrives. Hopefully, the high-temp PLA plays better with PETG so I won’t be spending time clearing clogged nozzle. It might be a couple weeks before I do the experiment, but I will report back.

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Awesome, I will try Formfutura Helios Support with the AMS. I consulted FilamentWorld on this topic and the guy agreed to Helios over Atlas because you can match printing temperatures with Helios + PETG. You are bang on on 2. The PLA turns into glass at 250 °C that Bambu uses to purge PETG at, thus forming quite a blob. Every youtube reviewer mentions the same - mixing different materials with single-extruder machines sooner or later leads to clogging ruining your day every time you try. IDEX is ideal for multi-material, especially different print temps and if Bambu Lab makes an IDEX machine next, I’ll be the first in line to try it with dissolvable supports.

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RE - Cardboard Spools

Many viable solutions to this, and mine is using 3/4 inch / 19mm wide plain masking tape around the edge. Wrap one layer plus about 2 inches / 4cm overlap on the spool, tight but don’t rip the tape, then smooth out the sides as best you can. You will get some wrinkles but they will not impact the function in the AMS. I’ve run 20+ spools this way and no problems.

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So 3DJake recommended HIPS for supporting PETG. Anyone tried HIPS in the AMS?

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The bad thing with hips is the removal steps needed to dissolve it that’s another reason why I use USM.

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I just found this so I order a roll but will have to test it out for external support interface layers with petg and if the factory spool will fit in the AMS.

★【YXPOLYER Breakaway-80 3d printer filament】YXPOLYER Breakaway-80 is a support filament that is easy to print, peel and store. The printing and storage method is simple, and it is not sensitive to conventional moisture and heat.
★【Features & applications】The temperature resistance of this support filament can reach above 95°C. It is very easy to print and has good adhesion. The resulting support structure can be easily removed and does not need to be peeled off with a solution. It is an excellent support material for dual-head printers. It is applied to the printing support of complex parts, and can be used with ABS, ASA, Nylon, PC, PETG and other consumables.
★【Printing conditions】We recommend print this Breakaway-80 filament at a printing temperature of 220℃-260℃, bed temperature of 100-110°C.

Amazon $48.99

YXPOLYER Breakaway Support Filament

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Let us know how it turns out. The only review specific to the “Breakaway-80,natural White” format was one-star. I hope you have better luck with it.

Regarding: my other post, my AMS hasn’t arrived yet, but my P1P is up and running. I will try the high-temperature PLA to support PETG with a manual filament change over the weekend.

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I regularly use PETG as support interface for PA-CF. Those filaments don’t adhere at all to each other and have similar print temperatures.

Wouldn’t something like eSun Nylon Natural work as support interface for PETG?

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Cross contamination would be the only concern, causing strength issues.

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Hi, I’m by no means an expert as I’m still fairly new to FDM printing (did SLA for a while already) but so far I’ve printed three PETG parts with PLA support interfaces and have had zero nozzle clogs. Not sure why you seem to have that many problems with it. Bambu studio did warn me about the bed temperature being to high for PLA and I should leave the front door open, but I only did that for the first print, not any more for the others.

I was using the Anycubic white PLA, with standard nozzle temperature settings for PLA. Perhaps worth noting that I did not print the entire support with PLA, but really only a single layer of support interface. The support bases I’ve printed in PETG, again standard PETG nozzle temperature.

So, all in all, when printing with PETG, I set

  • the support base to the same PETG as the actual print
  • the support interface to PLA (accepting Bambu Sudios suggestions for 0 z distance between interface and print etc)
  • the PLA bed temp to the same as PETG to not change the bed temp during the print
  • because the bed temperature settings are not good for PLA, I make sure to not have any support interfaces directly on the print bed.

So far this seems to work fine for me.

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It also worked for me at first, not sure why it keeps clogging now. Also only using PLA for support interface. Matching bed temp is a good idea, didn’t realize it would wait extra time to cool down otherwise. The print time and amount of the PLA support interface is only a couple seconds, so I tried increasing it by lowering print speed and adding a big purge tower with high purge volume. Didn’t help either. Part weakness is because of contamination really is an issue, had layer disconnects at different points in the prints of same part. I do print a very big part with 250 mm long straight wall lines so the tiniest warping can cause too much strain on the layers causing them to come apart…