Company: releases product
Community: improves product via addons
Company: removes ability to improve product under guise of ‘muh security’, while other manufacturers are both secure and don’t mind 3rd party addons at all
Concerned: express concern
You: “show the advertised functions stating that third-party accessories would work”
This argument is invalid. Lemme show you simple example: before the advent of “integrated media centers” in cars the car stereo system was easily replaceable. I don’t think any car company said “you can replace the stereo!” but everybody assumed that to be the case. If car company then would say: “hey, your non-car-brand stereo will stop working” you can’t imagine how upset car enthusiast would be.
The panda touch situation is another example: the panda devs showed how the discussion went and how were they ghosted and since they operate within general 3d printing community where developing addons is seen as “the norm” they went about their way doing NORMAL thing. And now people like you go “oh well, you shouldn’t expect the normal way to apply”. But hey, look at the X1Plus: it managed to become a thing! and it even got approval! Panda touch is far less intrusive than X1Plus, uses normal protocol, doesn’t root the firmware… So why block it?
If I don’t receive an official response, does that entitle me to implement a homebrewed solution and then blame the company when my product stops working?
Open-source enthusiasts at their so-called finest?
Either you wait and follow the correct process, or you accept the consequences, that applies whether you’re a community member who believes you’re adding value to the company or another company that thinks they simply can’t wait.
Once again, where is the official documentation from Bambu Lab stating that third-party products will be supported in any manner not explicitly defined by Bambu Lab?
I have yet to find any such documentation. Do you have any official documents that confirm this? I’d genuinely like to review them, but as it stands, there appear to be no guarantees from Bambu Lab regarding support for third-party extensions or modifications.
Yes it does matter, the anti-consumer behaviours and telling people what they can do with their own machines are not good. I shouldn’t care whether Ford tells me to not use Panasonic radio in my car nor should I care if Bambu says I shouldn’t use Panda Touch or Orca Slicer.
I’ll keep repeating this over and over: the way they try to “fix” security issues is not on-par with industry standard:
Bambu could and should’ve hired actual security experts that would be able to implement industry standard (or better) security at no harm to 3rd party integration.
Talking up personal bonafides for pages makes a person seem insecure, not an expert. It is helpful sometimes to take a step back and ask oneself “what am I trying to accomplish here?”
-sharing a salient thought with others?
-making myself feel whole by proving my worth?
-presenting opinions as facts, hoping to be perceived as an expert?
-engaging in listening and responding for the sake of collegiality?
-gripping “rightness” tightly because I’ll feel momentarily superior once I finally get universal agreement?
-is to help or antagonize? Which one fills your cup?
Personally I do my best (but don’t always fully succeed) to ask myself these questions before I hit send. No one likes being talked down to - and it is an instant turn-off from taking in any advice. It is also an ineffective way to shore-up one’s self concept.
It’s amazing to me how some people without any actual background see all this unfold, see Bambu Connect and the network plugin get dismantled within hours and expose horrendously bad practices regarding security and still just defend the company…
Johnny, this continuous back and forth is useless. Through its latest actions Bambu has managed to divide its users into those who think that whatever Bambu says and does is good and justified no matter the result or the consequences, and into those who have the bad habit of using their brains and dare articulate an open challenge to Bambu’s unorthodox practices by saying “hold on, that’s not how it works; and the end doesn’t justify your chosen means”. aThis schism won’t change until those “pro” whatever Bambu does is good will have to face the consequences of their own choices. Only by then it will be too late to change anything and a hard life lesson will be learned (if any at all).
I suggest to no longer fall for those “biting” us into these useless debates and focus instead on what we can do to make out the most of our machines while keeping them outside Bambu’s walled garden .
We understand you enjoy showcasing that, but what about the documents that existed before you purchased the printer? Do they exist in reality, or only in your imagination? If they didn’t exist before that, it’s clear they never claimed third-party products would be supported. So why did you buy it? Whether you consider it an anti-consumer strategy is irrelevant—they never stated this was intended to be a function of the printer.
Are there documents that show that ANY non-explicitly open-hardware item ever supports current and future 3rd-party mods and add-ons? This strategy is deliberately arguing in bad faith.
To you then I propose a challenge: don’t ever use anything that’s not expressly supported in documentation of any product you use.
And to the author of this thread: never use anything “tainted” by open source.
If I use undocumented features that stop working because the company made changes, I don’t complain like the rest of you. If I need something to work long-term, I use official, supported methods - never undocumented shortcuts.
Pray tell what exactly is undocumented about Bambu’s own network plugin that they themselves pulled into OrcaSlicer for example?
HomeAssistant and the Panda Touch also don’t use “undocumented shortcuts”, they use MQTT as implemented by Bambu themselves.
You keep rambling on about this nonsense and have no idea what you’re actually talking about.
People who think that way are the reason why so many companies think anti-consumer behaviours are ok to try and some do get away with them. And people who think that way are the reason why right to repair and other pro-consumer regulations have fought for and be written into law…
“Im not complaining” oh how nice of you to not complain about big company, yet you’re complaining about people expressing pro-consumer sentiments or the thing that you said that I “like to keep highlighting” that the method they chose to do “muh security” is wrong? What do you need - having something similar to OSHA and Building Code that requires certain level of security in net connectivity? Do I need to flash my MSc diploma and years of experience before big company protector like you understands that maybe me and people like me are correct?
And calling standard protocols “undocummented shortcuts” is downight bad look. The protocols don’t even change, all they do is sign certain operations like that would magically make them “safe” XD.
Please provide the official documentation for the MQTT interface that allows posting to the printer. If none exists, then there is no official method for what BIGTREETECH did. Call it whatever you want, but it’s not the official approach - that’s a fact, no matter how much you complain about it.
I collect game consoles, many of which had exploitable bugs that allowed modding to bypass system security. I’m sure you’d be whining just as much if server-side checks had been implemented to block modded systems. Would you have called that a consumer-unfriendly move too? Plenty of users complained back then, but they knew from the start that modding their consoles wasn’t an official way to run region-locked games or other content.
So, show me the official documentation stating that third parties are allowed to use Bambu Lab’s system however they like and bypass the official communication methods with the printer. Also, provide the official documentation for Bambu Lab’s MQTT implementation, including what the printer listens to and how it interacts. If no such documentation exists, then there simply is no official path for third parties to follow.
You claim it’s not officially supported yet BambuLab give you the actual way to access this in their own Wiki and have published their network plugin to OrcaSlicer…
You are the one that’s spreading misinformation and relentlessly defending a million dollar company that is actively cutting your rights and altering the deal. Think about that.
Show me the exact commands required to perform actions on the printer, then.
Knowing MQTT doesn’t mean knowing every message the system expects to execute specific actions. Please, enlighten me. The only available source for these MQTT commands seems to be a GitHub page that most likely reverse-engineered them.
This document lists all the applications and ports required for the printer. Please check the setting of the router or your PC to make sure these ports are not blocked.
