I’m a female, I know how to clean a kitchen (haha?!). So what exactly is the problem with the laser cutter? Just wipe and it and vacuum it. I don’t understand why it’s so magically difficult that everyone says you can’t buy it.
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I’m no expert on the matter, mine hasn’t arrived yet and I have no prior experience with lasers.
Reading through the cleaning guide though it seems rather time intensive: H2D Regular cleaning and maintenance recommendations | Bambu Lab Wiki
I’ve also read many comments from laser enthusiasts that state how stuck on the grime is when doing laser work, so it seems to require some elbow grease to really get it off.
I’m quite adept at cleaning but I’m also hesitant to mess up my 3d printing capability so I’m going to wait a bit to see how this all shakes out in a few months after people get a good amount of time out of the laser version before I reconsider firing mine up. My personal preference of usages was 3d printing and then blade cutting, but I’ll take a “free” laser cutter out of it.
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I’m thinking that if it was used primarily as a laser cutting machine it would get pretty grimy and dirty.
I’m not at all interested in trying to get heavy into laser engraving. But when it was announced I said why not just get a printer that has it. Just for the novelty of it. So when I get mine in a few weeks, I’ll use the laser once in awhile. But I’m going to use it primarily for 3D printing.
I also think that if you keep up on the cleaning, it’s not going to be a big deal.
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I’ve had a few CO2 laser systems, vaporizing material leaves a film on everything. I can see that as an issue on a machine with this many sensors.
I like keeping my printer meticulously clean. My feeling is it’ll be fine for occasional use, if you want a heavy use laser buy a dedicated machine. I have a 40w one coming, I’m not that worried and am fine cleaning it after use.
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Yeah. I’ve had a 40W CO2 cutter for maybe going on 5 years or so. Laser cutting generates a tremendous amount of smoke, which often leaves a sticky residue on every surface that’s exposed to the smoke, as well as a lot of very fine dust-like particulate.
Inside the printer’s build space the smoke and particulate is going to go everywhere. Any surfaces that need to move past each other (like belts and bearings and rods) will eventually get gummed up with laser cutter “swarf”.
In my opinion, the H2D’s laser is a mistake. I can see why BBL thought it might appeal to their customer base. But I’m guessing none of them were seriously in to laser cutting before they settled on the concept. I think people who make heavy use of the laser are going to be unhappy with having to repeatedly meticulously clean their machines to get decent quality prints. It’s possible the Bambu guys did something clever to make the mechanics less susceptible to contamination, but from what I’ve seen I don’t think that’s the case. My understanding is that the laser module clips to the front of the printhead, so that complex mechanism with it’s extruder and movable dribble-shield and nozzle positioning system is going to be really susceptible to laser cutting debris.
Even my laser cutter, which was designed from the ground up to do nothing but laser cutting, requires periodic disassembly to clean it up. The exhaust fan in particular gets heavily loaded up with gunk that has to be dissolved off with a solvent (or chipped off with an Xacto knife).
“Convergence” makes sense in an appliance you need to carry in your pocket (like a cell phone, which is also a computer) but not so much for a machine tool (there are exceptions of course, but they tend to be very high end “all in one” machining systems). For someone with a “maker space” workshop (or work area), unless you’re operating out of a very limited area and just don’t have room for two machines, IMO separate machines would be the way to go.
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“smoke everywhere”
So how is this different from cleaning an oven?
Do it every week, or wipe it lightly every time you use it, it surely can’t be that hard for you?
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Buy it, find out and let us know.
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I’ve had my Epilog laser for 23 years now. Some things leave little to no residue if you evacuate the fumes well enough. I cut card stock used in making cartons and boxes, it leaves a tar like residue behind that is probably part of the calendaring process. Wood, whether plywood or natural unprocessed wood, will also leave a tar like residue. Plastic leaves a nasty stinky residue that I absolutely hate. Leather stinks like burning flesh for days.
If contamination builds up on the lens or mirrors, the laser energy will react with it and will damage the lens or mirror. Most of this residue will be very close to where it’s generated, i.e. on the underside of the tool head and on the cutting grid or build plate but if fume extraction isn’t strong enough, it will be everywhere inside the printer. You may have to leave the fume extraction on for many hours to make the room tolerable if you cut anything really stinky like 2 ply engraving plastic. I picked up a well used Epilog that is a year newer than my original machine and while it had had some care, it took a couple of hours to get rid of the lingering smell of burnt wood and plastic. Think getting in a smoker’s car to head to lunch. Doable but ugh.
My machine uses slides which are more tolerant to junk build up as they run on a film of grease, the carbon rods have much more surface contact with no lubricant barrier and will be more likely to bind in there is anything on them. I’ve had to coach people in how to free up frozen carbon rods in their X1C printers due to printing ABS with poor ventilation.
I run a 2 HP 1500 CFM dust collect as a fume extractor. Even with this, I still need to clean things every now and then as they get tacky or the lens and mirrors become dirty enough to risk damage. Also, knowing that cutting vinyl is a BIG no, I still did thinking i had enough fume extraction. The result was the bed leveling springs, along with anything else made of steel now has a lovely rusty patina. The inside of the duct work is sticky and sticky and probably toxic.
I use IPA or 409 to clean everything but the optics. For the optics, Epilog included a bottle of cleaner that I’ve been very careful to use sparingly so as to not run out although I’m sure I can find something online pretty easily. I will admit to cleaning the $200 focus lens and mirror with dish soap but it’s not recommended as the mirrors are first surface. First surface means that the reflective surface is on the front, the laser energy does not pass through the substrate first.
I think a laser project every now and then will be just fine but you would need to really stay on top of it or the high speed and precision of the 3D printing mode will suffer.
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Lasermike, please note: there are no carbon rods in an H2D. It’s linear guideway across X, and two pairs of round hardened steel guideshaft on Y. The belts are 10mm, and quite exposed.
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@Deafcat22 I’ll admit I put no effort into researching the mechanics of the H2D. I incorrectly assumed it was an embiginated X1C. Are the linear guides greased? That would reduce the concern about residue build up but will still require routine cleaning and re-greasing. If the bearings are an engineering plastic, they may run loose enough to have the clearance needed to be able to deal with residue but run the risk of having hard particles getting embedded in them. The Epilog’s X belt is about 62" long and is fully exposed, it’s almost in the direct path of fume extraction. So far the only issue with it is that it’s stretched enough that the tensioner is maxed out.
Does the H2D have air assist when cutting? That will help keep the lens and underside of the tool head cleaner.
Eponymous, I use an xTool laser and inside the chamber there are no moving parts; the two lasers are behind a lens, so cleaning is limited to the green sliding cover and the bed. It’s good practice to keep the bed clean but not to the extent of a 3D printer bed. The H2D on the other hand has very many parts including threads, belts, etc. so ‘Just wipe and vacuum it’ might be quite a chore and the threads should remain lubricated. I really like the idea of a multi-machine, I just think it will be problematic, time will tell.
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I clean mirrors, lens and the honeycomb bed in my CO2 laser with oven cleaner, soap and water. Lasers produce considerable amounts of smoke that rusts exposed soft metal and must be extinguished out of the room. I couldn’t imagine laser cutting wood inside a printer. It’s like adding a pizza oven to your car. Could it be done? Sure but do they really think more people are going to buy this printer versus a separate laser cutter?
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The rails and rods have bearings. I doubt they are sealed bearings. So the byproducts of the laser cutting are going to get in to those bearings. As well as the gears and related mechanisms in the printhead.
Your oven does not have a high-precision motion control system built in to it. If it did, you wouldn’t be able to just spray some oven cleaner on it and wipe it down. You’d have to remove it from the oven and disassemble it to clean and relubricate it before reassembling and reinstalling.
You’re basically equating the process of cleaning the inside of a mechanical wrist watch with the process for cleaning the box the watch came in. 
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If you cleaned and wiped it down regularly you would not need to disassemble and deep clean it so frequently.
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No, it doesn’t work that way. If you owned a laser cutter, it’d be easier to understand. Smoke and particulate get in to places you can’t wipe. Stuff goes everywhere inside the machine. The stuff you can easily wipe down generally isn’t parts that actually care much about contamination. You can’t wipe down the insides of bearings, for example. Or the gunk that builds up between the cogs on the belts.
Like I said, the H2D printhead mechanism looks fairly complex. And it’s a high precision mechanism (think “clockwork”). I’m thinking it’s not going to take a lot of laser residue to gum it up to the point it no longer works reliably. Wiping it down won’t make a difference to that, it’s going to need to be taken apart to be cleaned. If you have to do that every, say, 10 hours of lasering, it’s a process that’s going to get frustrating pretty quick.
Convergence like this makes sense if you have no other option. Like a combo microwave/convection oven for your small kitchen. Or one of those washer/dryer all-in-ones for small apartments. But lasering is a fundamentally dirty process that does not demand a super-high degree of accuracy (at least, not until you get in to the industrial fiber laser category), and 3D printing is a process that fundamentally requires smoothly operating, highly accurate mechanics. It’s hard to see how they’re going to coexist successfully inside the same box.
Maybe the BBL guys have it figured out and they’ll publish something to explain the design features. Haven’t seen anything as yet, though.
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you can get bigger lazer cutters for cheap now that dont sacrifice the life of your printer although its great to have everyting in one machine, id prefer to have them separate
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I do not see the argument against the laser. As far as I have seen the printing quality was not sacrificed to make the laser work. As seen in the maintenance document they have clearly done testing on the residue build-up and it’s effect on print quality.
If I ever use the laser it will be briefly, and that cleaning/maintenance will be minimal. I think with or without the laser, the H2D is the best printer on the market and I have used quite a few. There are issues to be worked out but I don’t think the laser is one of them. I don’t think I would buy it as only a laser cutter, and I don’t think that’s its target.
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In case it wasn’t mentioned yet, her oven doesn’t cut plywood and plastics and what have you. Also, oven temp versus laser temp, add an extra 1500 degrees. Laser isn’t baking a cake, it’s literally vaporizing solid materials.
This does beg the question though: why didn’t Bambu labs add easy bake functionality for a bit less money, instead of this diode laser ■■■■ with limited functionality? I get hungry for cake or bread way more often than I feel the need to vaporize things inside my FDM printer.
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Well according to the CNC Kitchen interview with Dr Tao the whole laser thing is to supplement his remote plane flying needs and his family’s needs. So I guess it does not have an easy bake oven feature because dr tao doesn’t bake. Lol
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I do have the Creality laser.
I do not have the Bambu laser because I wanted the printer fast and laser isn’t shipping yet. (H2D has arrived).
What I think is happening might be cultural or gender differences in how we approach cleaning the thing.