@MakerWorld I would like to humbly suggest one tiny change to MakerWorld that I feel would stop ONE of the ways people are trying to point farm. Thus making it a more enjoyable experience for everyone and decreasing the work load of the people who have to respond to reports.
Currently if you click on any of the “trending” models you will see they all have at least one print profile that someone else uploaded that doesn’t even have a picture and is either exactly the same as the creators profile or with a tiny change, like 5% less infill. Some of them have LOTS of bogus profiles that are just trying to siphon off points. Look at this poor guy:
In the last week I’ve run across some accounts that have uploaded tons of bogus print profiles to other people’s models. One had HUNDREDS. I would like to propose changes that would stop this:
Remove the option to select where the points go. If someone wants to add a print profile to someone else’s model then the points go to the model creator.
Allow the model creator to accept or deny print profiles on their models.
Remove the ability for anyone other than the creator to upload print profiles.
I think option #3 would be what most people would prefer.
I’m not sure how but I think I missed that whole thread lol. I knew I couldn’t be the only person seeing it. Over the last week I’ve found people who it looks like started out uploading their own models but as soon as they figured out they could just get points by uploading print profiles to really popular models that’s all they do now.
As someone who do occasionally profiles for 3rdparty models
Why? If creator didn’t post profile, a small bonus for profile creator that needs those 4 stars to stay afloat is imho OK.
Good idea, however creates a burden for the creator if it were on per-case basis.
How about: if designer hasn’t uploaded profile - allow, if designer had uploaded - let the designer decide whether to allow profiles / ask on per-case-basis / disallow.
Also - a better policy in simply automatically checking changes between designer’s profile and new upload would eliminate a lot of BS.
Another problem is created by Exclusive Model Program: in case I’d want to do a change that justifies either new profile or remix, when the model’s in EMP I can only do a profile.
But in all the cases I’m talking about the creator DID upload a profile. That’s what the scammers are downloading and then re-uploading with a photoshopped picture, or one of the pictures from the reviews, or just a picture of the build plate.
Agree with most things. But me personally, i don’t have any hopes makerworld will do anything about it. It’s my third week reporting a profile that someone posted on one of my models because the profile “breaks” the functionality of the model with makers supply parts that people buy and then it won’t fit… no “denied”, no message, nothing…
They are too busy with a banner for the christmas contest. A BANNER!!!
I’m with you. I firmly believe that designers should have final say on any profile uploaded to their models.
I know that this topic has been discussed at length across several threads in the past year with not much acknowledgement from Bambu. I’m not sure if I actually read this somewhere or if it’s just an impression that I’ve got from speaking with support over the past 10 months, but I believe Bambu’s position is the-more-profiles-the-better.
As much as I want full control over our models, I don’t believe they are ever going to give it to us. It would cause too much drama. If we were able to just trim any unwanted profile from our models, there would be a mass exodus of profiles from Makerworld which would overload support with complaints and if those profiles also lost the points attached, there would be riots.
At this point, I think what we should be pushing for is a hard cap on the amount of 3rd party profiles.
I would like to see a cap of 50. You can upload a maximum of 50 profiles on models that aren’t yours and unlimited profiles on your own models. This would prevent farmers from uploading 500+ 3rd party profiles. Anyone who currently has over 50 3rd party profiles published will not be able to upload any new 3rd party profiles until they have brought their total below 50, but they will still be able to upload unlimited profiles on their own designs.
I would also like to see a cap of three on the amount of 3rd party profiles allowed on any one model. You can still upload as many profiles as you want on that shiny new model you just released, but only three 3rd party profiles can be uploaded before the option is locked.
I believe something along those lines is our best hope for preventing future farmers.
I think they should be allowed, the platform is meant to make things easy and usable through the app. Not every designer is competent when it comes to print settings. Also not every designer wants to upload multiple profiles for different setups. The only real issue is that there is zero reason for creators to actually want other people’s profiles on their models. There’s only downsides for the designer. There simply needs to be an upside for the designers, while keeping the incentives for others as well.
Just a small side note, that doesn’t really have anything to do with the exclusive program. It’s due to the license, any model with the standard license or even a CC ND license wouldn’t allow remixes to be distributed without permission. That also includes print profiles where the model is altered.
It does because EMP incentivises Standard License and tons of models that used to be CC non-ND got changed into Standard to rake in Exclusive points, while preventing further remixes. It’s 2nd order effect, but it’s undeniable.
It’s not a problem created by the program though. You may see more standard licenses because people want to join it. But the actually problem as you say is with the licenses and not the program. The license doesn’t prevent remixes btw, just requires permission.
But that wasn’t really my point, my main point was that even a print profile would require permission if you change the model, aka remix it.
It is created by the program explicitly in a way I’ve described: people switched models from CC non-ND licences to Standard. Now you can’t upload remix of it even if you had the model before licence change. Also - uploading with standard licence is incentivized vs CC one.
Try upload a remix of model under standard licence and correctly mark it as remix and point to the remixed model in MW.
Depends on definitions, but let’s say anything that’s easily done in slicer I wouldn’t consider remix enough to warrant a “remix” notation. But that’s completely off-topic.
I don’t like “hard caps” for anything. This is reactionary thinking in search of brute force solutions. Grant designer the ability to manage 3rd-party profiles on their model and the problem’s gone without any hard caps.
That’s not off topic as it was my entire point. I was simply pointing out that even a print profile would require permission, contrary to what your comment implied by saying “I can only do a profile” in regards to models with standard licenses. Sure, technically you’re supposed to choose remix when uploading a remix but if you look on the platform, that’s clearly not a hard rule. Combined with the fact that they rely on reports. As long as you have permission, you can upload remixes as “original” and provide any required attributions in the description.
Also there’s no depending on definitions, as I’ve said if you change the model. The degree of difficulty, and whether it’s done within a slicer or full modeling program doesn’t matter. If the model itself is changed, it’s a derivative work and would thus require permission or be subject to removal when reported.
I also occasionally add profiles to other prints when I legitimately think it’s adding value for other users. That said I agree with people saying that it seems there are a growing number of people abusing the system and uploading useless profiles just to try and skim points.
Overall I think the simplest option if they wanted to do anything about this though would be just let the designer have a choice to disable anyone else from adding print profiles, as long as they had uploaded at least one profile themselves. But the choice would need to be made when the model is initially published, and then it cannot be changed after that point. That would avoid any messiness with being picky about certain profiles others are uploading down the line.
Also correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t the designer still get credit for model (not profile) downloads regardless of which profile is printed or downloaded? So the designer still does get some benefit if people are downloading and printing profiles the other people uploaded on their model.
Yeah, I looked at the wrong download count when I compared it. So I think it’s fine the way it is personally. The vast majority of people will use the designers profile anyways, unless it’s proven to be bad, and print profiles earn very little rewards in comparison.
To me this makes the most sense. Because in a normal situation the person who creates and uploads the print profile still profits of the model creators original work because he wants to print und use the model for himself. The profile upload is just a by-product step that could also be seems as a suggestion to optimize the printing process.
Straight-out blocking would be bad imo.
I also have (popular) prints where people just copied my profile just to gain points:
I only download print profiles from the designer, figuring profiles from others are just preference changes. I prefer to use my own preferences.
Just a thought, but I have been thinking that a designer could put up several profiles for each of their models, as casual users, as with everything else, won’t look too far down the list. I’m not sure what the exact breakdown is, but studies have shown that for something like 2/3rds of people, unless there is a glaring difference, will chose the first option given.
Just a thought, but I have been thinking that a designer could put up several profiles for each of their models, as casual users, as with everything else, won’t look too far down the list. I’m not sure what the exact breakdown is, but studies have shown that for something like 2/3rds of people, unless there is a glaring difference, will chose the first option given.
Putting up artificially additional print profiles from the designer side just adds more unnecessary work for the designer and confusion for the user - imo.
Also look at my model above. This model only has those two print profiles. They are basically identical in terms of settings and thumbnail. A lot of people still choose the “non-designer” profile even though it was published much later than mine. There is no difference.
There is an easy fix … but it has to come from Bambulab.
Hard caps you’ve suggested are IMHO harder to implement and bring less overal benefits to designers than ability to manage 3rdparty profiles.
Also - what’s stopping those 500+ profile makers from creating 10 accounts each with 50 “earning” profiles…
On the flipside taking away an incentive to contribute profile where there’s none or when designer’s profile lacks something just because spammers use that is a knee-jerk reaction.
Bad people ruining good stuff for everyone…
Yes, the designer takes benefits from the model. A download and print of 3rdparty profile counts towards model and profile and the reward for model is 4x that of print profile. Also - “profile leeches” only get normal amounts of points for profiles made even for exclusive models (so there’s additional tiiiiny benefit for designer to publish own profile). And obviously a profile to be “profitable” must be above 4-stars rating. That whole “profile leeching” is a crappy gamble imho.
There are several situations where profile brings benefit to designer, the most important being upload of print profile for model that doesn’t have one. Without profile a model cannot be printed via Bambu Handy so profile enables that and allows model creator to “rake in” the points for those prints and model creator is rewarded for the model 4x that of profile maker (or 5x if the model is in exclusive program).
Personally - I had user upload a profile which allowed mounting on curved surfaces and I haven’t thought of that. I don’t mind them getting points for that.
That’s actually against profile upload guidelines.
The option to delete such profile would be great (I’m all for designers being able to manage 3rdparty profiles), but the option to report is there. Simply report the profile and cite MakerWorld Print Profile Upload Guidelines section “Prohibited practices”, point 3: Uploading print profiles repeatedly - I’ve never had problems when phrased using exact rules.
